Mary-Frances Winters, founder of the Winters Group, a diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) consultancy spoke to Berrett-Koehler virtually about recent events in the racial justice movement. Her latest book, Black Fatigue, which will come out in the fall from B-K, focuses on the exhaustion that many minorities experience being asked to educate well intentioned whites about their experience. She reflected on how her work has changed over time starting from an emphasis on diversity being a business imperative to it now being about social justice and the right thing to do for the survival of the entire human race.